related to this topic.

That aside – I don’t believe for a moment that Jonathan said what he said to gain attention in the Flash industry. Not from my conversations with him, at least. I’m not particularly sure he needs or wants that attention to be honest.

I think he was speaking from a frustration that many of have felt for a long while – and I’m talking about a broad range of people over about 15 years here. Nobody really knows where this area is heading, nobody really has a clear definition of what they do (see some of the conversations on the IxD list) and much of it is technologically determined. It’s not going to change anytime soon. It’s what makes it exciting to work in, but it’s also frustrating too. Keeping a balance between us trying to discover and define the medium and the medium (or, rather, the tools) defining us is important.

Andy & Josh – such a f’k'n awesome and respectful debate
I honestly could read this dispute all day long and I agree with many points
made, I agree with many things that many people said however 1 point that is very sadly so true in this day and age
is that clients do not & will not “get this” until ..hmm who knows when

Jonathan Harris’s work is great and yes it has a message, right on, great, ok,
but a true master of any art form is humble, I mean its just rude to group everyone and to assume to be an “authority” to judge us all, is it any wonder, people are feeling rubbed the wrong way ?
but I’m just wondering … if anyone walked into lets say a sculptor’s conference, a glass blowing seminar or lets say a top fashion designers conference etc. etc. etc. <>
and imagine a respected figure walked in and closed a conference in the same style to what Jonathan Harris said about approach, current works (be it commercial or experimental / personal) and the message sent out by their chosen “apparatus” or “tools”.

I think this response must have been expected

first of all, we are talking about only a decade of this “tool” flash … not even a teenager.
Can anyone name something so vernal (except processing) that could have such an effect on the world… be it social media, digital media, advertising media, broadcast media, cinema, art, music, typography, animation, programming… the list goes on, Flash has touched it.

Maybe we can forget for second – what we actually produce
and look at the fact of what it is produced by – a piece of software
the fact that its the most downloaded piece of software in the history of the world and has more viewers than any art gallery or publication …
FACT – more people on this planet know about “subservient chicken” than they do about Pollock’s ‘number 8′ or ‘The Persistence of Memory’ by Salvador Dalí.

Flash as a software is bigger than some religions ..sorry if that’s offensive
to anyone (I’m both spiritual_&_religious) so anyone who is enraged …please go burn your John Lennon records :)

this “TOOL’ that no one apparently knows how to talk with yet or isn’t saying anything meaningful ….
I mean as true as that statement can possibly be, is as wrong as it possibly is to even say it, especially to those that enjoy pushing the envelope

I mean lets break it down … and lets not beat around the bush here
quintessentially – its a conference called FLASH on the beach !!!
no matter what your profession, skill or weapon of choice …if you don’t have some love for flash then your in the wrong f’k'n place mate.

its just so premature, that its obviously obvious
True its a tool but its such a relatively new tool compared to other “artistic” tools
its like someone saying to NASA that they are just tinkering with space travel

“now you can fly, where will you go”

its not that simple

Anyone could stand on stage and give the same observation to anything so young so of course its all just embryonic looking at it, each satellite or mission to Mars is “tinkering” and it could take 199 years for the next major historic breakthrough …but you could argue that each milestone is a masterpiece, something to take your breath away

So consider the fact that the same kinda non-encouraging statements were said back in the 60′s & 70′s when electronic musical instruments like the synthesizer started generating sounds in popular music …it was just a tool
and yes you need to incorporate real life experiences and involve some emotion, create a message

People didn’t see this new wave of music as anything important, it wasn’t even considered a talent or indeed a “real” instrument or art form.
They were just people tinkering around with wires… no masterpiece in sight.

Musical artists all over the world probably said similar things to people like Kraftwork, Jean Michelle Jarr, Mike Oldfield
questions like “now you have learnt to play these synthetic instruments, what will you compose?”

and they just probably looked blankly and said …
“I’ll just continue doing what I’m doing thanks, so if you want Mozart go look elsewhere, just doing what we do, if you like it cool, if not no problem”

So has Jean Michelle Jarr ever created a masterpiece?
… some would argue (me included to be honest) probably f**king not
but he had the biggest concert ever with 3.5 million
and with 80 million albums and singles sold, so kudos to him.

Jean Michelle Jarr will your music make someone gasp or cry?
- probably f**king not
Does your music feel as special as a love song?
- probably f**king not
Does your music truly represent our time?
- probably f**king not
Will your music still feel relevant in 25 years?
- probably f**king not
Does it sound like something that’s never been heard before?
- probably f**king not
Does it compare to the masterpieces of other musical styles?
- probably f**king not
Could it have gone further?
- probably f**king not

I don’t know … you don’t know… Jonathan Harris doesn’t know, Jean Michelle Jarr doesn’t know. Nobody knows until who knows when, time will tell
but will Jean Michelle Jarr continue to do what he does …of course.

Andy if you had said the same things it probably would have been better received. What would have been far better would have been some praise to the fact that we are all just stepping stones to the talents of the future
we are only carving a path for the future masterpieces … and no credit will be given when we are all long gone and forgotten.

no one ever gave Elisha Gray, Thomas A. Edison or Robert Moog any credit for tinkering with digital music back in the day but ask yourself
how much of today’s most successful, awarded and praised music is digital.

From Billion dollar conglomerate industries such as Virgin Group all the way up to world altering events such a Hiroshima were all based on the results of “tinkering” with technology

so what if we are all sans-masterpiece in some peoples opinions
then I, for one, am happy to be part of the ‘fallen ones’ who helped lay down the path, however small my contribution, so that someone, maybe many years after me, can create something that could be considered worthy of answering the great all mighty question posed by Mr. Harris
“Once you have learned how to speak, what will you say?”
… Baka ie!

in my opinion I think Jonathan was both bold and contemptuous to say what he said…and as much as I want to thank him for making everyone address this and talk about the obvious truths when dealing with such a young art form BUT
I’m still going with my initial gut feeling
…and that it is not some thought provoking genius reverse psychology to inspire us all and make us all up our game, revolt against client briefs etc. etc.
but mealy it is a pre-meditated way to shake a traditionally peaceful hornets nest and gain more attention in an industry where he was being shadowed by such shining talents, who for whatever reason or circumstance are bound by client limitations and projects that don’t allow funds for any wild and fancy freedom of expression.

still it makes for a great debate :)

For myself, questions like “will this still be relevant in 25 years?” stop my creative process cold. So it’s interesting to know they inspire other people, and perhaps those people will find Jonathan Harris’s talk helpful. There’s no one gospel on how to make art; as long as everyone realizes that, we can have a fascinating conversation.

Clients do often only see the glossy, clichéd stuff, which is why it’s really important for work like Jonathan’s and many others to get seen by other designers, developers and producers so that they might feed back to their clients some new ideas. Of course, clients should also go and see that stuff too. It goes both ways and it’s an old problem from long before the days of Flash (as anyone watching Mad Men will have seen).

I will try my best to write this all up (and, of course, the rest of FOTB) as evenly as possible in Creative Review. The good thing is that quite a few clients read it.